OpenAI’s CPO on how AI changes must-have skills, moats, coding, startup playbooks, more | Kevin Weil (CPO at OpenAI, ex-Instagram, Twitter) · Lenny's Podcast: Product | Career | Growth summary

Key takeaways

AI is evolving at a rapid pace, and developers are encouraged to keep pushing boundaries as models become more capable.
Writing effective evals is increasingly important and can determine how products are built and refined.
OpenAI's agile approach to product development fosters a collaborative and fluid environment, which is essential for innovation.
Despite the emergence of new technologies, chat interfaces remain valuable in human-computer interaction.
Hiring for high agency and adaptability is crucial for teams working in areas marked by ambiguity and rapid change.
AI has tremendous potential to address educational disparities and enhance personalized learning experiences.
The experience with the Libra project provides key lessons for the future of finance technology and the necessary steps towards innovation.

Summary

The Importance of Evals in AI

Evals or AI evaluation tests are becoming critical for product management. Kevin explains that tests help gauge how well models perform in various contexts, indicating the need for improved fine-tuning when building applications.

Building Products at OpenAI

The structure and philosophy behind product development at OpenAI emphasize agility and iterative processes. Kevin shares insights into how OpenAI operates and the role of teams in generating new products rapidly, as well as using data effectively to inform decisions.

The Role of Chat and Models in Product Development

The discussion touches on the enduring value of chat as an interface for AI. Kevin clarifies that while chat interfaces might seem outdated, they offer a universal method for human-computer interaction that fits AI's capabilities.

Hiring and Team Collaboration

When it comes to sourcing talent, OpenAI prioritizes traits like high agency and comfort with ambiguity. Kevin explains the integration between product managers and researchers for innovation, shaping a fluid working environment.

Future of AI in Society

Kevin shares his optimistic outlook on AI's potential impacts, especially in education where personalized tutoring could transform learning. He discusses the societal shifts expected due to AI and reflects on the Libra project's setbacks, indicating what was learned from that experience in the context of finance and technology.

Show notes

Kevin Weil is the chief product officer at OpenAI, where he oversees the development of ChatGPT, enterprise products, and the OpenAI API. Prior to OpenAI, Kevin was head of product at Twitter, Instagram, and Planet, and was instrumental in the development of the Libra (later Novi) cryptocurrency project at Facebook.

In this episode, you’ll learn:

1. How OpenAI structures its product teams and maintains agility while developing cutting-edge AI

2. The power of model ensembles—using multiple specialized models together like a company of humans with different skills

3. Why writing effective evals (AI evaluation tests) is becoming a critical skill for product managers

4. The surprisingly enduring value of chat as an interface for AI, despite predictions of its obsolescence

5. How “vibe coding” is changing how companies operate

6. What OpenAI looks for when hiring product managers (hint: high agency and comfort with ambiguity)

7. “Model maximalism” and why today’s AI is the worst you’ll ever use again

8. Practical prompting techniques that improve AI interactions, including example-based prompting

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Where to find Kevin Weil:

• X: https://x.com/kevinweil

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kevinweil/

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Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com

• X: https://twitter.com/lennysan

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

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In this episode, we cover:

(00:00) Kevin’s background

(04:06) OpenAI’s new image model

(06:52) The role of chief product officer at OpenAI

(10:18) His recruitment story and joining OpenAI

(17:20) The importance of evals in AI

(24:59) Shipping quickly and consistently

(28:34) Product reviews and iterative deployment

(39:35) Chat as an interface for AI

(43:59) Collaboration between researchers and product teams

(46:41) Hiring product managers at OpenAI

(48:45) Embracing ambiguity in product management

(51:41) The role of AI in product teams

(53:21) Vibe coding and AI prototyping

(55:55) The future of product teams and fine-tuned models

(01:04:36) AI in education

(01:06:42) Optimism and concerns about AI’s future

(01:16:37) Reflections on the Libra project

(01:20:37) Lightning round and final thoughts

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Referenced:

• OpenAI: https://openai.com/

• The AI-Generated Studio Ghibli Trend, Explained: https://www.forbes.com/sites/danidiplacido/2025/03/27/the-ai-generated-studio-ghibli-trend-explained/

• Introducing 4o Image Generation: https://openai.com/index/introducing-4o-image-generation/

• Waymo: https://waymo.com/

• X: https://x.com

• Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/

• Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/

• Planet: https://www.planet.com/

• Sam Altman on X: https://x.com/sama

• A conversation with OpenAI’s CPO Kevin Weil, Anthropic’s CPO Mike Krieger, and Sarah Guo: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IxkvVZua28k

• OpenAI evals: https://github.com/openai/evals

• Deep Research: https://openai.com/index/introducing-deep-research/

• Ev Williams on X: https://x.com/ev

• OpenAI API: https://platform.openai.com/docs/overview

• Dwight Eisenhower quote: https://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/dwight_d_eisenhower_164720

• Inside Bolt: From near-death to ~$40m ARR in 5 months—one of the fastest-growing products in history | Eric Simons (founder & CEO of StackBlitz): https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/inside-bolt-eric-simons

• StackBlitz: https://stackblitz.com/

• Claude 3.5 Sonnet: https://www.anthropic.com/news/claude-3-5-sonnet

• Anthropic: https://www.anthropic.com/

• Four-minute mile: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Four-minute_mile

• Chad: https://chatgpt.com/g/g-3F100ZiIe-chad-open-a-i

• Dario Amodei on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/dario-amodei-3934934/

• Figma: https://www.figma.com/

• Julia Villagra on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/juliavillagra/

• Andrej Karpathy on X: https://x.com/karpathy

• Silicon Valley CEO says ‘vibe coding’ lets 10 engineers do the work of 100—here’s how to use it: https://fortune.com/2025/03/26/silicon-valley-ceo-says-vibe-coding-lets-10-engineers-do-the-work-of-100-heres-how-to-use-it/

• Cursor: https://www.cursor.com/

• Windsurf: https://codeium.com/windsurf

• GitHub Copilot: https://github.com/features/copilot

• Patrick Srail on X: https://x.com/patricksrail

• Khan Academy: https://www.khanacademy.org/

• CK-12 Education: https://www.ck12.org/

• Sora: https://openai.com/sora/

• Sam Altman’s post on X about creative writing: https://x.com/sama/status/1899535387435086115

• Diem (formerly known as Libra): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diem_(digital_currency)

• Novi: https://about.fb.com/news/2020/05/welcome-to-novi/

• David Marcus on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/dmarcus/

• Peter Zeihan on X: https://x.com/PeterZeihan

• The Wheel of Time on Prime Video: https://www.amazon.com/Wheel-Time-Season-1/dp/B09F59CZ7R

• Top Gun: Maverick on Prime Video: https://www.amazon.com/Top-Gun-Maverick-Joseph-Kosinski/dp/B0DM2LYL8G

• Thinking like a gardener not a builder, organizing teams like slime mold, the adjacent possible, and other unconventional product advice | Alex Komoroske (Stripe, Google): https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/unconventional-product-advice-alex-komoroske

• MySQL: https://www.mysql.com/

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Recommended books:

• Co-Intelligence: Living and Working with AI: https://www.amazon.com/Co-Intelligence-Living-Working-Ethan-Mollick/dp/059371671X

• The Accidental Superpower: Ten Years On: https://www.amazon.com/Accidental-Superpower-Ten-Years/dp/1538767341

• Cable Cowboy: https://www.amazon.com/Cable-Cowboy-Malone-Modern-Business/dp/047170637X

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Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.

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Lenny may be an investor in the companies discussed.

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OpenAI’s CPO on how AI changes must-have skills, moats, coding, startup playbooks, more | Kevin Weil (CPO at OpenAI, ex-Instagram, Twitter)